Dairy Farming in Pakistan
A dedicated section by MomekhAs with everything else on this site, 99% of the information is free. Please feel free to browse around and learn as much as you can. Many of the tactics can be learnt.
Is this your first time on this site? Then I recommend you read the original article on Dairy Farming in Pakistan. That article explains a lot of valuable decisions. After you have read that article, you can continue to take advantage of this section below. Thank you.
Some of the questions asked here have been answered on this page: Dairy Farming Questions Answered.
Welcome to the Dairy Farming Section.
I love simplicity. And I will try to keep this simple.
Dairy farming business can be divided into three main systems. Each system will have its very own set of processes, milestones and benchmarks. Dividing a project into smaller projects (or systems) helps you focus on each, without feeling overwhelmed. In dairy farming especially, it is very easy to become overwhelmed. Hopefully, not here.
These three systems are:
- The Environment: This is the environment of the animals and how you, as a dairy farm owner, plan to manage it. Cooling of the shed etc. Click Here to read more on The Environment of your dairy farm.
- Ration / Feed: What are you feeding the animals, and how are you procuring and growing that feed.
- Breed Management: Includes the health of the animals. Also includes your own benchmarks of the type of breeds that you want to introduce in your farm. This is one of the most overlooked aspect of any dairy farm.
All three of these systems are equally important and your dairy farm will have a higher chance of success if you get these three systems right.
Serious about dairy farming?
Serious about Dairy Farming? Then you may find The Dairy Farming Guide by Momekh to be useful. I wrote this because a lot of dairy farms get their tactics right, but fail due to bad strategy (i.e. bad mindset of the owner). Click here to know more.
As with everything else on this site, 99% of the information is free. Please feel free to browse around and learn as much as you can. Many of the tactics can be learnt.
Some of the questions asked here have been answered on this page: Dairy Farming Questions Answered.
Welcome to the Dairy Farming Section.
I love simplicity. And I will try to keep this simple.
Dairy farming business can be divided into three main systems. Each system will have its very own set of processes, milestones and benchmarks. Dividing a project into smaller projects (or systems) helps you focus on each, without feeling overwhelmed. In dairy farming especially, it is very easy to become overwhelmed. Hopefully, not here.
These three systems are:
- The Environment: This is the environment of the animals and how you, as a dairy farm owner, plan to manage it. Cooling of the shed etc. Click Here to read more on The Environment of your dairy farm.
- Ration / Feed: What are you feeding the animals, and how are you procuring and growing that feed.
- Breed Management: Includes the health of the animals. Also includes your own benchmarks of the type of breeds that you want to introduce in your farm. This is one of the most overlooked aspect of any dairy farm.
All three of these systems are equally important and your dairy farm will have a higher chance of success if you get these three systems right.
As more content (articles, videos, interviews, books etc) gets introduced in this section, the content will be categorized according to these three systems.
Goes without saying, basic systems such as accounting, human resource management etc are not unique to dairy farming. Advice on setting up these basic business systems can readily be found on the Internet, and besides, business systems are usually a result of the business owners’ personal requirement (and sometimes ‘taste’). Interested in how I set up my business systems, then check out the Starta post to get an idea.
List of Resources for Your Dairy Farm:
- Want to read about the uniqueness of a dairy farming business, and what are them most important activities that you should look after? Click here to read the answer.
- Basics of Silage Preparation? Check out this page.
I have inshAllah planned to put up a lot of resources, and linking to them from this page.
How to start your own Milk Brand? I started a milk distribution business before I started dairy farming. Alhumdulillah, that milk distribution business was profitable in the first month. I have written a detailed case study on starting a successful milk distribution, and how you can start a milk brand yourself. To read more / purchase, click here.
As you can see, this page is a work in progress. I suggest you subscribe to Life ETC for future updates on dairy farming, and how to be a better entrepreneur.
Hi,
Im interested in investing in a diary farm in punjab, pakistan.
I have no experience but i have the finances.
What can you tell me about the typical profit to be made from a venture, do you base it on number of cows or size of land etc.
From your own experience what profits or maybe even losses have you made?
Thankyou in advance.
Habib
Uk
Good way to decide on size is either number of animals or qty of milk sold per day. After you decide on this, you can determin profit possibilities.
As Mr Malik said, base your calculations on the number of animals or the quantity of milk.
But I’d like to add to this:
Focus on the quantity of the milk. For example, if you have a dairy farm with 10 animals, you should think in terms of 10×15 = 150 liters of milk average, over 10 months. Too many people think in terms of number of animals only, and that can be very dangerous.
I know of a farm that has 8 cows (local cross-bred cows!) that is producing MORE milk than another farm a few acres away with more than 60 milking animals! That is 8 animals vs 60, and the 8 are producing more milk than what the 60 are producing combined. The owner of 60 cows may boast of “herd-size” or “assets”… I guess. :/
And a word on experience; you said that you have no experience. Well, my friend, then you are at the right place! 🙂 (unconventional strategies at LifeETC )
I did not have any experience either. 😛 Just keep at it. InshAllah, you’ll get there soon enough.
Mr. Habib
We have completed our study to set up a Cattle Farming in suburbarn area of Karachi. Recently I am in Lahore and work as an exective in a local Bank. My team has completed the survey and feasibility to set up a Cattle Farm ( Not only Dairy) back in Karachi.
Our core product will be Kamori , Gulbai and RajanPuri Goat. Besides we will also raise different breeds of cows. In order to generate revenue for operational expenses we have plan to keep and raise Kajla Sheep for sale and Australian Cows for Milk and their male calf for sale.
On rental farming setup of 4 Acres – the CAPEX is PKR 7 Million and OPEX for first year only is PKR 3.5 Million. From 2nd year onwards farm will generate its own opex. Total Initial Investment is PKR 10.5 Million.
Investor has to wait for 30 months approx. After expiry of the 30 months period Investor will be resturned 10.5 Million. After 12 months 3 Million of Profit will be shared with Investor and this profit will be locked for next 10 years with no further investment in future as Farm will produce its own production after 3 / 4 breeding cycles.
If you are Interested in Cattle Farming Business – please reply me at [email protected]
Regards
Salman Ferozi
i am not longer afordable
how can i start my dairy farm
Thankyou Naem,
right, can you or any one else help me map this out here on the forum, im sure others will benefit from it aswell.
If i buy land to house 100 cows what size would it need to be, Would this be different if i intend to grow my own feed. Is there a ratio i.e size per cow?
What is the typical cost of a cow?
How many litres can they produce and what can it be sold for?
If i dont grow my own feed what is the cost of feed per cow?
Has anyone got a detailed business plan or forecast?
Thanks
wow momekh, i just noticed your post right after i posted mine 🙂
Anyways dude i like your style!!! Your ‘can do’ attitude is surely rubbing off on me.
And i love it when you mention the 80/20 rule.
Guess what??
I hope your part of the 20 thats going to help me get my dairy farm up an running:)
If God so Wills. I’ll try 🙂
I will be posting a ‘forecasting’ sheet that I use for pretty much any of the projects that I plan. I’ll tweak it for ‘dairy farming’ and inshAllah, include it with the ‘business plan’ for dairy farming.
I will probably be putting it online for free… God willing. Hope this helps. God bless and good luck!
JazakallahIl keep an eye for it. In the mean time i’l carry on researching 😉
a.o.a sir
you article abt dairy farmig is impressive.u r doing very great job.
i want to srat up dairy farming business.plz can u help me for its feasibility.
at the start of time i m very confused.plz give me proper guidance.
aami 123,
dont worry, you’ve come to the right place 😉
bro momekh has said he’ll be putting up some more info soon so thats definately worth a wait.
You just gotta remember whats been said before, the first steps the hardest!
Have you a list of questions that need answering? I think that will help you get to where you want be.
I have loads:)
What cows to buy? imported or homegrown? how much they cost?
What to feed the cows? to buy or to grow your own?
Buy land or rent land? I prefer buying as I have surplus cash which I’d love to invest in a large piece of land, maybe 12 acres, 100 kanals.
And the list can go on…but we have to start somehwere dont we;)
Sensie momekh hehe, as you can see, theres a lot of souls waiting for your master plan…:)
i was picking momekh’s brain on the other blog entry. Now I will just follow the pearls of wisdom on this forum.
thanks
hey guys,
I am in the process of setting up my own dairy farm in the Northern Part of Punjab. I recently finished touring a number of milk producing districts of Punjab myself and met a number of farmers raniging in size from as large as 1800 animals to 20 animal farms. The feedback I recieved was diverse as every farmer had their own personal preferences varying in building design to fodder choice and animal breeds.
Momek you are doing a good job and I think the info you provide is going to be very helpful for young entrepreneurs however there is no short cut to experience and I strongly suggest to all those considering undertaking this business opportunity to not just read theory but step out into the field and meet farmers in person as you will learn alot more and would really be able to understand the dynamics of this business as well as work out your own business plan accordingly.
It is no doubt a profitable venture however looking after live animals is not like any other business, it is something which requires a lot of care and attention and most important of all “presence” of the owner considerably more as compared to other businesses especially during the initial stages.
Anyways good luck to all wishing to undertake dairy farming ventures and keep sharing your experiences!!
Thank you for your valuable comments!
I agree that there is no shortcut to experience, and all theory is pretty useless unless it is followed by action.
aslam o alaikam,
hope u r enjoying good health. i want to start my own dairy biz.
iwant to hire sahiwal cows nd then crossed it from australian breeds.
what u sujjest about it. nd plz also inform me the average per day of
pure sahiwal cow. thanks
Hey Sardar Aamir..How u doing??
Nice to know you’ve taken these imporant steps.
Im also doing my research, be it theoretical but we have to start somewhere eh.
Id love it if you could provide some insight as to your experiences so far.
What herd size are you planning for ? Im gonna go for 50 initially inshallah.
You chosen what breed of cow? Im thinking of importing so as to get higher yield!
You gonna buy or lease the land? Im gonna buy (always had a dream of owning a farm 😉 )
You gonna grow your own feed? still researching myself!!
What rate you planning on selling the milk and to who?
It’ be awsome if bro momekh could share some specifics of his dairy farm as well.
Peace Out
InshAllah, your dream will come true, friend.
I will be putting up pictures of my farm as well (I am writing a small article on installing a fan to manage the heat stress for the animals).
Hey Habib,
You seem to be on the right track.I am also planning to set up two farms in two seperate locations starting with 50 animals on each. I will be importing crossbred animals from Australia dont even think of searching from the local markets cause it will be years before you can put together a decent herd of 50 animals!
As for land,I personally think if you are passionate about farming then you should buy your land cause farming is a slow and gradual process when you are going to put so much effort into developing a piece of land the last thing you want to do is to hand it over to the owners after developing it over years and putting so much hard work into it.
Agriculture is our family business and we already own land so I will be carrying out the cultivation of Green Fodder as well as maize on our own lands.
As for selling the milk I will probably be selling to Nestle along with Marketing our brand aswell.
Hope this helps!
Thanks for the informative reply sardar aamir.
Dont want to bug you but how much land you got and what proportion are you gonna use for the fodder?
Im thinking of buying around 25 acres in Punjab. Me dads in Pak so ive told him to source me some decent farmable land.
Is the target price we should be looking to get for our milk at 36 rupees reasonable???
Just as a quick note: the price of milk varies considerably. A farm near Pakpattan will sell the milk at Rs 34 per liter to Nestle, whereas a farm in Lahore is selling milk at Rs 47 per liter to a milkman. The price fluctuates significantly, and it must be found out within an area. It is safer to go with Nestle (it helps in planning)… I am selling to Nestle, another friend is selling to a dhoodhi (milkman).
Hope this helps in the conversation…
hey,
you are not bugging me at all bro, I am glad I can be of help. I myself have been bugging farmers starting from across Canada to Pakistan, visiting farms, meeting farmers discussing how they do what they do. Its all part of the learning process and the more you ‘BUG’ the more you’ll learn 😉
I am thinking of cultivating around 50 acres to begin with increasing as my herd size increases. A general rule here is about 3 to 4 animals can be fed on one acre of land if it is irrigated,this is for soilage and then you have to give about 4 to 6 kg of Grain or locally made ‘Wunda’ a packaged diet of different grains etc.
As for the price Momek is right it does vary from place to place and whom you sell to. I think Nestle is a safe bet to begin with and their initial price starts at around Rs 36 to 37 per liter, then you get incentives for different things like your volume, chilling etc etc.
Aslam o Alikum,
You guys doing fantastic job especially Momekh bhai that ll’ assist number of people around the world most importantly in pakistan. Most of us are new to this but i’m sure it ll’ not as difficult as it seems to be if we ll continue helping each other and sharing significant information, Inshallah.
Thank you for the kind words!
Sharing goes a long way indeed… I wish all of us the best of both worlds 😉
Salaam,
Firstly I’d like to congratulate and thank mr momekh burki on an excellent blog. Very informative and some great responses from everyone else. I am a foreign investor and have been looking into this business for a couple of years and think I’m now ready to take the plunge. I several questions and would appreciate if you could help in answering these for me.
1. What is the best way to overcome the current electricity problem, I have heard that biogas is one option, hi viable is this for a farm of 50. And is solar an option as well. I’m assuming Not much electricity is used on these farms, except in summer.(just a guess).
2.what help is available I have heard that nestle will help you but then you are tied into a contract with them, is this true and isit worth doing.
3. What the Pakistan dairy association, are they of any help at all, I have noticed that there website has not been updated for several years now.
Basically I’m ready to start but need some kind of design of sheds and help on that side. I’m assuming again that even though I intend on starting a farm of just 50, I need to plan ahead so I don’t need to keep reconstructing as farm grows.
I really look forward in hearing your thoughts.
ws bro Aleem,
Really good questions posed. I too am planning to invest in this sector. Inshallah still trying to source some land to start with around 50-100 cows.
As you mentioned you want to start with 50 cows, have you thought how much land you’ll need.
I’ve seen some pretty impressive shed designs online, not too sure on the cost or space required. Ive heard if you want to splash out you can even import a shed!!
Maybe theres a simple formulae to calculate how much space each cow requires in the shed??
Anyways looking forward to others to chime in.
p.s has any one a detailed business plan / profit loss forecast for this business. I know SMEDA provide one but has any one got their own.. love to compare and contrast:)
I know bro Momekh said he’ll be putting one up soon 😉
Salam brother habib,
Basically I have abt 18 acres in the village my father is from and rather than let the land waste I thought I’d invest some money, this way it secures the land as well.
My main concern is the current electricity problem there, I knw people say wait for the government to change etc. But sorry to say my feeling are that no matter what government we have, we shudnt have this problem, not in 2011 anyways. From what I have seen in Pakistan, basically the people are evolving but the country is not. ( anyways that’s a long discussion probably fir another blog)
So u see, because of the above issue I feel I need to have a set up where I Dnt have to rely on the country, if that makes sense.
There is an excellent video on you tube of pakistans first ever environmental control farm, and I have to say, it looks great. This particular farm is using the dung to produce electricity and therefore the farm is self sufficient. The farm is capable of keeping the inside temp as low as 20•c while outside the temp is 42.
My other concern is water, can filtration systems be added so the water out of the ground is filtered or treated before it goes out. As I believe Pakistan has many areas where the water is hard.
Looking forward to hearing everyone’s thoughts and if u haven’t already please type in YouTube “dairy farm Pakistan” and see the video I am referring to. I believe smeda had a big hand in it.
Salaam all
Slam,
Please shed some light on law and order situation in villages. Is it easy to start farm there. I heard that cows get stolen by ” Dakus ” . And unless u have an army of people with guns, its really hard to manage dairy farm.
Is there any formal training available for wanna be dairy farmers. Since i don’t have any prior agri experience. I want to learn the basics of the dairy farming and than dive into this business.
And please give your detailed analysis on why you choose local cow over a foreign one. Please tell me what is the average of local cow.
And lastly please update this blog frequently. As I have not seen a new article for some time.
Thanks and I appreciate your entrepreneurial spirit
Regards,
It mainly depends a lot on the area where you are opening your farm, of course.
It is not the case everywhere of course. There are places where you need to be careful. And the people you hire, the people who are managing the business for you, they should be trustworthy by all means. That is true for any business, more so in Dairy Farming.
If you are planning to stay at your farm, then that’s a bit different, but still… you do need to secure your farm. Again, It mainly depends a lot on the area where you are opening your farm, of course.
You will have to do that research yourself. Ask around.
One Word of Advice: IF YOU ARE planning to manage the farm Yourself, then make sure it is not far from your residence. I have met a person who is willing to sell his whole farm (land, animals everything) for the main reason that the farm was about 3 hours away from his residence.
We should not get carried away in our zest to start! If you have a reliable team managing your farm, then it is OK to be as far away from the farm as you wish (you can be in New York and you farm in Haveli Lakha, whatever! 😛 )… but if you do not and initially you plan to do it yourself, either you shift your residence to the dairy farm, or have the dairy farm close to your residence. 🙂
Salaam brother momekh,
Can u kindly read my post dated june 6, and shed some light to the electricity problem and biogas options.
Hey Aleem…
I have seen BioGas generated from dairy farms (in a small village called Naagpal, near Pakpattan!)
And without a generator (either running on petrol or biogas), you can not keep the farm environment cool enough. So yes, a generator is a MUST for the summers, given the electricity situation in the rural areas.
Thanks Momekh for the advice.
How many cows u have currently?
Salam to All,
MashAllah very nice to see contribution from every one… Great sharings!!
Just want to ask and request you guys to please share your knowledge about the use of Solar energy fro Agri purpose ?
Take care
Hi. A wonderful blog. I plan to start a dairy farm; currently I am working in a multinaitonal company and would leave the job altogether and work on this project full time. I intend to work in a dairy farm for 2-4 months before starting my own project. What do you think about this?
Now i want to be very sure of the input costs. Can you guide me on below:
– Say i buy a local cow for 100,000. HOw much milk should i expect for the 300 day lactation period.
– What is the daily feed requirement for this cow? what are the basic components of cow feed?
I ma planning to start it near Karachi where almost all feed is brough from Punjab or interior sindh. I dont intend to grow my own feed. I would appreciate if you could explain in detail the feed requirement.
You do not need to do a job in the dairy industry to find out how it works, but it can be a good idea if done properly, I think.
A local cow for 100,000 will give an average of about 10-12 liters for the lactation (if you manage to keep it relatively cool during the summer season!). I suggest that you buy a smaller number of cows, but try to get better cross-bred cows. In the range of 130 to 150,000, you can get cows that give an average of 15 to 18 per day for the lactation period.
The basic components of cow feed are usually covered by feeding them corn, in the form of silage. And then adding some ‘wanda’. There are different calculations, not that complex, to figure out how much acres you’d need to for the cows. For example, I used the formula of 3 cows per acre of maize for silage, for one year. When I say it like this, I don’t know if I have been able to make you understand, but just get in touch with any good Nestle person (or a PhD from the Livestock govt dept) to get the exact requirements.
For Wanda: For a cow giving 3 liters of milk, you’d give 1 kg of wanda. So if your cow gives you 15 liters, you’d give it 15/3 = 5 kgs of wanda per day. This will increase the liters AND the health of your animal, God willing.
Green fodder (like chaara and jawaar) is overrated. Although Barseem (winter chaara) is excellent and you can save costs on wanda by halving the wanda and replacing with barseem. So if you are giving 4 kgs of wanda to a cow, you can give 2 kg and let the cow have a good fill from the barseem!
Hope this will get you going in the right direction.
God willing.
I am setting up a small course, and have lined up a few qualified people to give interviews and tutorials and instructions, put it up on video, and then make it available online to would-be dairy farmers in Pakistan, God willing.
Thank you for your support. Hope this helped.
Hi Momekh,
I have the same questiona as Ubaid has. What is average daily cost of fodder per cow.
Dear Momekh,
It is good to see so many people are getting interested in dairy farming, which is to me is a challenging job in current circumstances. I have covered the same number of miles for searching bufs which you have mentioned in one of your posts though after searching for number of weeks we could only manage to purchase only few.
It would be great if you can provide me the contact of people who are either breeders or local suppliers for buffaloes “Reliable Ones”. I am also looking for a good pedigree bull for bufs. Let me know what could be the range and where could i find one.
Looking forward to hear from you soon.
Thank You
Oshan Amin.
Rachna Livestock & Dairy Services has a data base,and can help you meet good buff breeders and will help you find good bull from Nili area.
Long silence ????
I am sincerely hoping that this is the silence before the storm 🙂
Because I have got a few things lined up, not only with Dairy Farming Section here, but also with Lifestyle Design 🙂 … and earning haq halaal kee online! 🙂
I am in fact at my dairy farm right now…preparing the next batch for silage, and am preparing a list of questions good folks like you have asked here, to answer them in the best of my capabilities, God willing. The beauty is, that I have some great teachers, and I keep bugging them. I am hoping to report back on my blog as I learn! 🙂
Thank you for the patience man.
Since you are preparing a list of quetions please add couple of more from my side:
1- How to get / hire a good Farm manager please briefly describe the qualities of a good Farm manager because you have one of them 🙂
2- What should be and average package for a Farm Manager.
3- Importance of water at dairy farm.
Cheers
Sir you advised to buy local breeds but the cattle’s in yours farm house seem to be cross …….what should be fair price of shaiwal breed cows and where can i find pure cows of that breed
I do not mean local breeds, I meant locally bred! 🙂 Sorry for the confusion. The thing is, I just don’t want to keep 100% pure bred cows because they are relatively harder to manage, and I want to take things a bit slowly with this project.
Please check out the Dairy Farming Questions Answers page, where I have talked about the Sahiwal breed.
Dear All,
Its indeed pleasure reading all the comments and the Blog of brother Momekh. Wonderful job brother.
I am a Karachi based Media Consultant by profession and I have also developed this “Shooq” of starting the Dairy Farming as well as Cattle Fattening Farming for Meat production as well as Eid Ul Azha.
I have following suggestions for all who want to start a dairy farm for Milk production or already running one:
1. The best step to increase milk production per animal is to keep them untied. Let them roam around (in fence).
2. Provide good shelter from the extreme weather and most importantly, given free access to water 24 hours a day 7 days per week. This can lead to an increase in production, resulting in cows producing an extra 1lt per day.
3. Fodder planning is an important step in reducing the reliance on the traditional practice of feeding low quality but high cost wheat straw. For this new varieties of fodder have been introduced such as multi-cut sorghum, Rhodes grass and Lucerne.
4. The new farm management practice of silage making must be mplemented to assist in overcoming feed shortage periods.
People living in Karachi and interested in setting up their own Dairy & Fattening Cattle Farm Houses, should sit together and share their experiences and observations with each other. If there are Karachiites here, lets meet sometime.
Zeeshan Jaffri
Excellent write up Zeeshan.
I would add two things here:
1. Silage should not be for ‘feed shortage’ periods, but should be the main fodder. It is actually cheaper and is more healthy than shorgum and what not.
2. A meet up of sorts is a brilliant idea and I totally agree that building and participating in a community is the best way forward. God guide and help us all.
Thank you for your feedback.
Thanks Momekh for providing us with an opportunity to interact and learn from each other. I always believe that more than one thinking head is better for ideas and businesses. We should help and support each other in order to build this nation and economy. My dream is that my beloved Pakistan becomes the top country in the world in terms of Milk and Meat production. In my visits to Farm Houses in Karachi and outskirts, I have seen that people are raising high-quality local and foreign breeds and earning upto 70% to 120% profit through cattle fattening for Eid ul Azha. Educated and sensible people should come forward and prove their metal in this field too.
All comments posted and really very informative. Sorry for pushing but it seems the below points needs to be addressed more precisely.
a) Average per cow fooder cost both in case we buy from local market or we grow on leased land.
As this is one of the main factors you have to consider while calculating operating cost.
Assalamualaikum,
I have a small piece of spare land (12 marlay) in Kharian. Will I be able to setup a small farm in this space.
I am new in this industry and dont have much knowledge about dairy farms. However I have done some research. I believe Australian cattle (holstein friesian cattle or holstein friesian cattle/jersy cross breed) is the best type for dairy farms. What would the cost be to setup a small farm?
Please can someone help and let me know how many cows I can keep in this amount of land and what I will require i.e shed, fans etc. Pictures of an existing farm would be great if anyone has pictures them.
BarakAllah
As salam alai kum
Thank you very much Mr. Momekh for giving us the opportunity to share our opinions.
it’s very good and very beneficial also to all who are in dairy farms business or want to start this business. it’s my dream to start the dairy farm business, however it’s still not possible for me because i have not too many funds to start the business. Can Mr. Momekh, you tell me that minimum how much funds I need to start this business. and also please give me your contact number and Mr. Zeeshan Jafri’, I also want to thank you for sharing the very fruitful information, can you also give me your number in order to meet you in any suitable time.
You are most welcome, Sultan! 🙂
What we need to do is ‘make a plan’. Money is a problem, as it was for me too. But that should not stop you from making a plan! Trust me on this… imagine for a moment that you do not have a financial problem, then work out a plan on how you personally will own or run your dairy farm?
This exercise alone will have two immediate benefits:
1. It will give you a MUCH clearer picture, and you will be able to see if you REALLY want to take up such a business. It will either further inspire your, or it will help you focus your energies on projects that you’d truly enjoy (enjoying our work is the single-most important thing for being creatively self-employed 🙂 ).
2. It will give you a very good approximation of how much money you’d need. This way, you might end up sharing this information with a trusted investor (your family members for example), and they too will see that you have done your homework.
I wish you all the best!
P.S. I am thinking of arranging a small meet up here in Lahore, regarding dairy farming (and other self-employment opportunities). What do you guys think?
assalamo alaikum Mr Sultan,
Can you please email me at [email protected]
Irfan
assalamo alaikum:
Even though I will not be able to attend because I am not in Lahore, I fully endorse Momekh’s idea of a meetup. It can be a starting point for some great synergy and co-operation in the future. Please keep us posted!
As salam alai kum
when could we see some pictures of your farm?
Sultan, your dream must come true one day brother, all you need to do is focus and concentration and the thirst of learning. Nothing is impossible in this world. All we need to do is prepare ourselves psychologically and financially and then plan in best possible manners to minimize the risks to optimum.
For instance, if you want to start it from your home-farm you can even start it with 5 animals. You need to decide if you want to keep animals for milk production or fattening purpose? Cost would vary in both the cases as Milk Cow, local and foreign cross, would cost you around 1 lakh per cow. But if you want a Cholistani or Sahiwal breed only, it can cost you 50 to 70 thousand.
Similarly, if you want to raise animals for beef production, cost depends on the age and size of the animal. A calf aged 3 to 5 months of Sahiwal+Foreign breed cross would cost you around 30 to 40 thousands and a same breed 1 year Cow could cost from 80 thousand to 1 lakh.
If you dont have much funds available the better is to start it with a small farm and get the experience first. Once you understand the dynamics of the Business, you can always invite others to see your business and invest.
Prepare yourself, read the material available online. Its not just a Business, you need to make it a passion as Animals need lot of love and care like our wives 🙂
You can always get in touch through [email protected]
Momekh’s idea of organizing a meeting would be great as people from similar interest can learn from each other. I would also try to join you guys in Lahore if i remain alive in the season of killing in Karachi. 🙂
please guide me how to manage people and fodder for cows. and from where i can get good quality cows
Dear Sir,
I am interested to set up farm for 50 animal (prefer buaffalo). Kindly pass how this possible and how much land require??
Averge cost and milk?
regards
A.O.A.,
A very strange question, I have 15 acres of land which is 25 kilometers away from my built factory. I have big halls 3 level with space for cargo lift of 18×18 feet. These could easily climately controlled. With these halls I have 2 level halls for milk processing, I have also lot other space but factory was built for medical devices.
Please advise me is it worth able to operate a diary farm.
Thank you.
You dont need climate controlled sheds for dairy farm.18 ft hgt is manageable,but one would have to visit before a lay out can be planned.How long are these sheds?
Hi, want to know fully about modernized silage from corm system and possibly seting up something for sales. Regards
Many people looking into commercial silage these days. Can be v.viable provided cost is reasonable.Ave acre of hybred corn will yeild abt 350 mnds. Engro and other parties are buying these days for abt 100 rs.a mnd.This is a poor price for the farmer.
AOA;
Can some brother who has experience on the fodder costs explain the cost of silage fooder per head / per day. Jazak Allah Khair.
AOA; can any brother give me suggestions about impotance of cattle in dairy than buffalo?thanx
1.cows eat less than buffs
2.produce more milk
3.mature earlier [18months]
4.less dry period
5.easier to handle
6.calve earlier
7.heard management easier
8 economically viable
Any way must be of good cross bred stock,with ave of above 15,ltr
milk output per day and last full lactation.
Dear Momekh / Naeem Malik
Need comments on the fact any disadvatage / de merit of a dairy farm adjacent to poultry controll shed.
the exhausts are not facing directly to dairy farm.
“I love Nature” Yes i really love, While leaving in the Karachi City too fast life style,
need some relax after observing people around working like machines but result “restlessness, impatient, full of frauds(1st with them selves), and lies”.
Nature Pure provide us energy, and a direct link to Allah’s creation and spark to thinking “what exact life is”
So well i am planning an alternative business (over pure neat lines no hanky panky) other than my current job architecture-interior-construction. Dairy and Cattle farming…the idea force me while i working for importing cattle Feed “Palm Kerenel Cake” Malaysia trying to provide and promote alternate to cotton seed cake, (banola Khali).
I select middle region of Punjab some where around Okara Military farms, to develop a farm for 20 – 100 over a time of some year on Modern line of structure and facilities to animals, Hygienic to all and production too, but trying to design structure on cheaper ways of construction.
I already read Sameda feasibility reports, other concerns but not enough information on life cycle of Cows and Buffaloes,
Like what is dry time,
what approx cost of feed per animal,
the best composition with green fooder and concentrate
how can electricity can be produced from dung Gas, where and what type of generator need.
Can any one guide me the rest.
momekh burki i m very glad to hear that you have become a dairy expert. i hope that 8 cows farm, which is better milk producer than a 60 cows farm, is owned by you. by chance i know the person who owns that 60 cows farm and will ask him to take advice from you.
Salam alikum sab logon,
Urdu main likhoonga kioonkay daftar main hoon,
haan to mere bhai, beroon e mulk kaafi log hain jo yeh karobaar shroo karna chahtay hain, lekin kahin se koi maloomat hi nahi milti, Allah aapka bhala kare jo aapne itni maloomat faraham ki.
Ap ka bohot bhala hoga inshAllah , agar aap human ‘figures’ faraham kar dain, yaani ke, doodh ki keemat e farokht waghera, Allah aapko khush rakhe, Pakistan dunia ka 6 sab se ziada abadi wala mulk hai, or agar hum log mil ke kuch karen to aaram se aik khud kafeel mulk ban sakte hain, or apni jaib bhi garam rakh sakte hain.
Masalam
AA,
Currently I am doing some preliminary research on cattle farming as I am eager to start a dairy farm/ cattle farm. I came across your blog and find it really helpful for novices like me. I appreciate your personal experience sharing as it is hard to know all this stuff from anybody already in this field. I really look forward for your help in near future. God bless you.
Regards,
Umair
ASA,
It really hard to find every thing on document either in any field unless you dive into the deep in practice, Finally after making sheets of sheets, collecting data from all resources, design and planning a farm and their basics,… I am gonna dive in……….
So i believe before going in….. check it all out left right ups and downs… and be prepare for hard struggle…
Dairy farming and Feed lot fattening… looks good… feel good, Give you good :).
May Allah bless my thoughts and care me and all of us… So keep praying .
A.H
Assalam-o-Allaikum Every Body,
Good day to all of you.
Its Ashfaq Hussain Duggal here with your from Dubaii (UAE) .
I am really glad to see the passions and interest of my young brothers in Livestock business. May Allah bless you all with success in all of your endeavors.
Having same desire and passion as I found in all of you, to own and run a Livestock & Dairy Farm. I am preparing the feasibility and cost analysis to start the project. Can any one please guide me on couple of questions.
1- Is imported OR local breed ed cattle best of Dairy Farming?
2- Holstein Heifers and Jersey, which one is best and yields high milk?
3- Does these breeds get adjust to all the four seasons of Punjab?
4-Most Important! what is the average price these days to Import a pure breed Cattle in Pakistan?
Desperately waiting for your kind reply.
Regards,
Ashfaq Hussain Duggal
From Samundri Faisalabad
Lives In – Dubaii – UAE
Will recomend local crossbred cows.
Lots of imported cows already in farms,with mixed results.
Saw bunch of imported cows being sold to butchers last summer near Sialkot.Most farms[imports] large farms with management from abroad.Do not let people know exact output. Some are doing ok.
Approx price non preg.heifer jer/fre cross from Aust.170,000.
Local crossbred fresh calved,approx price 125 to 150,000.
Hi,
i am new in this business i started it recently please guide me how can i take forward my business i bought 8 animals for milk and they r producing 80KG milk per day
10kgs per day is not a bad start.Try getting good qlty cows even if you have to pay little extra,will pay off. Your cows should ave 15 ltrs per day as mausum is good these days.
Naeem Sb. – In one of your posts you commented that cows are better than buffaloes in several ways. Can you tell me which cow breed yeids highest milk production? and how much does it cost? I’ve completed construction in my farm and planning to buy animals now. Your feedback would greatly help.
Locally bred crossbred cows are the highest yeilders.with good management,they will give you up to 18.ltrs per day.You can contact rachnaservices.com and my cell.0300.4858292.Top qlty cows these days range from 130 to 150,000 each.Fresh calved.
Mr. Naeem Malik do you sell cows at Chishtian center.
Chishtian.is one of the centres,wr mostly buff and cholistan cattle are collected and shipped.Pls advise your specific req.and will try to cater.
Dear All Specially respected Momekh
i read all the comments on this page vary seriously coz i m going to plan for small scale starting and testing dairy farming project (10 cows) near my village in my aggri land,
i am a P.hd student of regional planning in peshawar university, and working with World bank,
but my special interest in dairy farming is increasing day by day.
that y i have prepared a plan for 10 cows complete building and now in search and selection of breed so if u have time plz comment other wise i observed from the conversation that local cross breed is more suitable.
UR job is vary fabulous dear.
Crossbreds[local] most suitable for you,and this is good time to buy and start.If you need help contact rachnaservices.com
DR. Naeem Malik
sir i want to buy 2-3 fresh calved cross breed cows, will you please tell me from where of your farms i can visit and buy them.
Asslam -O- Alikum
This is Mudassar from New York.I would like to start a dairy farm in Sahiwal,Pakistan from where i basically belong.I would like to get some help from you for the set up.I know its hard but nothing is hard if someone want to get it done.Your blog is very informative and i have got some positive knowledge from it.But will love to get some basic advises from you guys. By the way i am also running a business here in NY USA but not in dairy farming .I have my family back there who will be managing this dairy farming business .I will be the investor.
Regards
Hello , how can i be part of conversation.
Very helpful site
Assalam O Aliekum
Respected sir
ur blog is very helpful and gives a lot of guidance to new commers.
i am a govt. employee but not satisfy my job due to less salary.
i want to open a dairy farm but have not enough money.
can you tell me about any organization or individual who support me or issue loan for such projects at low interests.
i hope your reply will be in detail and Beacon of light to me.
Assistant Manager / Manager Dairy Farm Operations
At Islamabad Dairies, we are looking for a young dynamic individual who can share our vision of sustainable growth in diversified business in the agricultural and dairy sector. Currently we run a 60 head farm with a vision and resources to double our capacity within next 8 months inshaAllah.
RESPONSIBILITIES:
Independently oversee all the technical operations of the farm including animal health, feed management and labor management.
Minimize production costs by introducing and implementing new ideas.
Maintain proper records and efficiently updates data in our management information system on computer.
Introduce profitable business ideas in the related sectors.
Maintain and upgrade agri-based knowledge of management and employees.
REQUIREMENTS:
Has four to six years of experience in operating a dairy farm preferably buffalos’.
Advanced degree in Agriculture, Animal Sciences or related field.
Technical expertise in animal husbandry including dairy and cattle production.
Believes in management information systems and timely reporting due to a distinctive management structure.
Self motivating and possess an ability to work on initiative.
Preferably a bachelor and agrees to reside on the facility in Islamabad.
Market salary can be expected along with free food and residence.
Should you be interested; please send your resume at
aoa.naeem sab what is the crossbred?plz tell me.
lambiiiii khamoshi.why?
I am considering to establish a small size Calf Growing Farm for Beef on land. Would you or some one else help me in this regards. I am available on 0300-8402218
Regards
Dear bro,
I’m successfully running my dairy farm in it’s 13th week now and MashAllah giving optimum production. I am getting excellent rates for my milk picked up from my farm being in the immediate suburbs of Islamabad.
Now I’m planning to launch a beef fattening project as well. Please share your knowledge and experience of the same. And be kind enough to discuss cheap/affordable shed construction methods. Ive made mine with traditional brick and fabricated roof structure. Now for my further venture I’m thinking either poles and cgi sheets or mud structure. Please advice ??
Regards and thanks
Hey that’s BRILLIANT news Adil, mashAllah.
And I highly recommend going for metal poles with a ‘desi’ mud structure on top for the roof. I use that on my shed and it has worked out so far (a few more details on this but I am sure you get the point).
I do not have any direct experience with calf fattening. Maybe someone else here can help?
I wish us all the best! 🙂
hi Adil! thats good to heat about your dairy farm. I am also a new comer at the moment i am working on my infrastructure.
please share some details with us like as follows.
1. with how many animals you have started.
2. what is the average milk your are getting.
3. could you be any help in buying me some animals with your contacts.
That is a great set of questions, Abdul Muqeem!
In fact, I would like to know these very details from ANYONE who has started a dairy farm! This information will really help all of us God willing.
Also, have you tried Rachna Services (Naeem Malik)? I keep recommending them, referring them (without any commission so far). They are very, very good to me. I wonder how other people are finding their service?
Hi
assalam o alikum
iam going to start new business like dairy farm
tell me what,s a quantity of animals i can take start i want to start frow 5 cows tell me this is fine or not bcz i dont have more money to buy more
plz guide me right way
thanks
Rizwan
Dear Momekh
Thanks for the appreciation 🙂 lets wait for Adil reply on the same. have few more queries would really appreciate if some one could reply on the same.
1. My farm would be ready for operations max end Feb / 1st week March i am building the silage bunkers at the moment. As have tried making out of sand so they are taking a bit more time than the normal concrete ones. What is suggestions that if bring in some animals may be 5-10cows what could be ideal / economic food for them at this time. Until silage is ready?
But when you say silage bunkers will be ready, do you mean the construction itself? or the silage? Because silage itself will take time to ‘ferment’ etc?
Hmmmmm !!!!! silage bunkers will be ready not silage.
It will take another 35-40 days which means i need to feed my animals say 60 days before silage is ready at my farm i.e from March – April. My silage will be ready 1st week March i believe. Now please advice.
Hi
assalam o alikum
iam going to start new business like dairy farm
tell me what,s a quantity of animals i can take start i want to start from 5 cows tell me this is fine or not bcz i dont have more money to buy more
plz guide me right way
thanks
Rizwan
Dear Abdul Muqeem,
Sorry for a delayed response
As for your queries, I started off with 10 buffaloes and seven cows, I am also keeping 10 goats. my avg milk production from buff/cow only is 200 kgs/day. sure i will help you. mail me on( [email protected] ) for my cell no/contact
With 10 buffs & 7 cows, I think that is a good start. How far are the animals in terms of lactation?
As they say, jaanwar sooay kabb thay… 🙂 I just want to know if these production levels are for freshly calved animals or not. 🙂
I wish you all the best!
Dear All
please confirm if any body could help me with regard to bio gas set up in the farm.
Regards
I am also very much interested in Bio Gas!! Have drawn some basic plans for it… inshAllah.
Maybe a write up Bio Gas will also help? Yes? 🙂
hi,
I wanna start a dairy Farm in Mainwali where is summer Temp can go up to 50 D. please suggest which milk breed that i need to select .and suggestion about dairy Shed, Supplier of feed mill and 30HP tractor. i have plenty of land.
Br
aamir Khan
Its quick and hot at forum,
For bio gas plant check youtube dr.Ashraf shabzada,
For cow breed its fursasian cross with sahiwal, suits best.
Dear Momekh
Details of lactation are as under
> 4 buff and 2 cows are in firat week of their 4th month and one was inseminated yesterday. 🙂
>one cow is in last week of 4th month and was also inseminated four days ago MashAllah, Alhamdulilah
> 6 buff and one cow is in second week of 3rd month
>2 cows are in their 1st month of lactation.
>one cow is in her second month.
ALHAMDULLILAH. I am expanding this coming month. New shed is under construction. Thanks to Momekh, this time my costs are way too less by adopting poles and t iron as construction material with a chappar on top.
wah bai wah, mashAllah 🙂
This is great news Adil. I wish you all the best! I think a visit is due to your farm inshAllah. Here’s hoping that you have good tea at your farm!?? 😀
BTW, Ive bought my live stock from Sahiwal, Thal, Sarghoda, and Gujrat mainly. This time I am off to Narowal and Head Tareemoon for the new batch. I stay there for three to four days while rooming in different villages and buying the stock after guaranteeing the milk production as promised by the owners. So far it has worked. While my mother is continuously praying for me at home. Kids prayers also help 🙂 …… dont think I am superstitious or anything but through personal experience, I tell you it works.
MOmekh, and everyone out there, please share the calf fattening project experience if you know or heard some.
p.s; never forget the Vet’s visit the very same day as soon as possible when so ever you bring in new livestock. Vet inspects the stock, injects anti pyre tic, vaccination if due, de worms the stock and advices on any other medication. While you must have plenty of Gurh to give to the new stock in order to releive their fatigue. LOVE AND KNOW YOUR ANIMAL, IT WILLBE SURLY RECIPROCATED. 🙂
I TOTALLY agree with you, Adil. Thank you for the valuable input! Especially the vet’s visit (a lot of people forget this in their excitement…)
I also try to buy animals that are already giving milk. This way, I can check their claimed milking capacity (I do three milkings before buying the cow.. and I count the third one as the final). You know what they say, “harr ghabban gaan mann duddh daindee hai” hahaha 😀
You are most welcome dear bro, anytime. I will serve more than just tea inshAllah. It is my pleasure to share my experiences and I am hoping to listen from others as well. I’ll inbox you my cell
aslam.o.alaikum
i want to make a dairy form on small bases
please tell me how much investment need?
Dear Momekh,
The idea of making my new shed with poles and t iron did not succeed. I have replaced the poles with brick pillars with iron guarders on top. I am keeping the roof simple this time with bamboo,chiks and white mud as discussed. the main reason to change the pillars and t iron roof was the fact that the livestock rub their bodies against the pillars as we know and the poles structure i found was not strong enough to withhold the rubbing or a bump/kick by an animal. so as they say, mehnga roye aik baar aur sasta baar baar, i went for the expensive option. Shed will be completing in two days InshAllah, than off to Narowaal for some good cow buying………will keep you guys posted
I keep only cows for now in the pole designed shed.
A lot of people also discourage me to put buffalo because buffalo have a nasty habit of rubbing against objects with all their weight! But I HAVE SEEN pole sheds housing buffalo.
What was the difference in cost per pole? I mean, if a pole 18′ in length costs for example, 8,000 to buy and 2,000 to fix… I am interested in knowing what is the price difference with just erecting brick pillars as compared to poles?
Great input, Adil. Thanks man.
And I wish you all the best janaab with your cow hunting!
salam
have you had any dealings with shahzad from jassar farms
if so do you reccommend jassar farms
wassalam
Dear Momekh,
There is not much difference in price like a pole as you mentioned costs 10000 in total per pillar whereas you can make 5 brick pillars in same money. the cost difference is while putting up steel guarders on top of these pillars which costs like 8000 for new and 4000 for used one per guarder plus the labour charges. in all the difference is not more than 10 % in total cost but the durability is much more with a brick structure and also the capacity of bricks to sustain heat and cold. Plus the rubbing issue of buffaloes is also solved due to brick pillars. Then it is also easy to hang Bori curtains on brick pillars in winters.
In all a 50 feet long shed with a width of 9 feet with a pakka roof of concrete guarders and pre fab hard tiles, hard brick floor plus good khurlis cost me around 375000 and the same shed without hard floor, and pakka chat replaced with the one i told you earlier cost me around 70000 to 85000. In this latest shed i used steel 2nd hand guarders instead of concrete one while roof i told you is made with steel pipes welded with steel guarders at one side and resting on brick wall the other end with top made of bamboo and chiks, plastic bag and mud and bhosa mix on top.
please note that the cost of both the above mentioned sheds does not include the price of already made full back walls of the sheds which should cost an additional 50 to 60 thousand
Dear All
Nice inputs!!! i am finally in a position to buy animals. More inputs regarding animals buying some recent experience would really be helpful.
Best Regards
Best livestock buying tip is to buy your livestock within these coming couple of weeks max,…. why, well, ’cause as soon as the weather opens up in Punjab, which is expected in these ongoing weeks, the prices of livestock will skyrocket by 20 to 30 percent at least.
Dear Adil,
its important before construction you will work theoretically, and collect all possible data.
WE all here on this forum basically work for betterment of Dairy farming not only to count money at the end, not only we have improve structure quality, durability, low cost, but even we must see the environmental impact ,how neat clean, air ventilation, water fog generator nozzles in summer, energy saving must be consider in construction methods, If all same phatatic dark,unclean , smelly, non comfortable environment constructed definit this will impact to animals and reduce the quality and quantity.
This Sunday i visit dairy exhibition in Karachi expo where i find shading fabric to cover the shed rather than thinking of cane roof. I got a piece of meters for doing experiment over it.
So again…… Think wisely!
That is the essence and very well put Babar. We are looking for a wholesome deal.
I think Adil have considered that too.
I wish us all the best 🙂
Thank you for your wise Input there Babar. I can assure you that I am keeping all the mentioned aspects in my mind as Momekh said so 🙂 . Healthy environment leads to healthy animals who in turns give optimum resulting in likewise profits. Fabric shed well I considered but they don’t serve the purpose in the extreme cold weather of Central and northern Punjab, Kpk and Balochistan as well.
Looking forward to hear from you and put us wise
i have few cows and wanted to expand this busniss who gives loan for this.
assalamo alaikum,
where is your farm ? Can you share your email address?
My farm’s near Pakpattan. And you can contact me via the contact form.
sorry, I meant to contact muslehuddin
Dear all, it is my pleasure to inform you that my visit to Narowal was a boomoing success wherein I was able to purchase 8 pure breed pehlans and one dojan that too pure breed. All in all coasted me on avg 130000 each. 5 are with wachis and 4 wachey…. 🙂 May Allah bless them. 40 villages in three days, my back and car both cracked, but all well as it ended well 🙂
hahahaha…car and back, both? 🙂 ایسا ہوتا ہے ایسے کاموں میں
And the news on the good purchases (130,000 is definitely a good price) is awesome news Adil. MashAllah. Here’s hoping and praying that they do well in your farm! 🙂
what is the per day yield of dojans second calvers ,
Dear Adil
Will you please tell me about how much milk these cows are giving.
🙂 Thx loads my dear brother. JazakAllah
i am working in Dubai.I am paksitani national next month i am going to Pakistan,there i want to start dairy farm with 20 cows, from where i can purchase cows i am serious please give me complete detail.
im running a dairy farm for last 3 yrs and can help you in getting animals, but before that you need to be sure do you really want to do this business. ill email u my number
Thank you Shahzad for your input. I hear you are quite the expert in procuring good quality animals! 🙂
And I am looking forward to seeing you at the meet up bhai saab 🙂
when and where is meet up ?
It is on the 31st. See this post https://momekh.com/2012/02/28/lets-meetup-in-lahore/
Dear Momekh
Salam, This is Farhan from Lahore. Can you bring your guide on meeting day along with you so that it’s easier for us.
Are you talking about bringing a physical copy of the guide? The guide is in digital format (a PDF) and is part of yet another experiment of me trying to earn honest income from the my own products. Thank you for your idea though, Farhan. I am looking forward to meet you at the meetup! 🙂
bro they are giving 82 to 92 kg/day
salam
Adil bhai i am from uk how are you getting on with your dairry farm
i hope to be starting soon inshAllah
any advice would be of help
I will be coming to jehlum soon
[email protected]
Salaam all. I have just found your site and am very excited. I am an Australian woman, married to a Pakistani and living in Rawalpindi (I am an agriculturalist in Australia, but a writer and e-Learning facilitator here). We have recently bought a farm near Fateh Jhang and are planning to build a dairy business. I will inshAllah buy your guide Momekh bhai, but can I ask… do you have any contacts in our area? We have been to a few cattle sales, and hear that there is a huge amount of fraud going on about how productive the cows are. Also i am keen to go with Sahiwals… anyone had any experience with them?
Great to meet you all and look forward to your advice!
Wasalaams Danielle!
The fields you mention; agriculturalist, writer and an e-learning facilitator – are way too interesting for me! 🙂 I welcome you to the LifeETC community.
Thank you for your support and I’d love to hear your feedback on the Dairy Farming Guide (DFG) once you’ve read it – especially given your agriculturalist background, I’d love some feedback from you! 🙂
And there are quite a few LifeETC community members – entrepreneurs who are operating a dairy farm in or near Rawalpindi. God willing, you are in good company.
The LifETC community is having a meetup in Lahore, more than a 100 people have registered, with a few coming from Islamabad/Rawalpindi as well. Read more about the meetup here. I look forward to meet you (and your family) at the event too! All the best, sister, and God bless!
Al Hamdulillah… seems like good company to be in. My mind is already ticking over about collaborative projects with eLearning courses in dairy farming (I write courses too!) I have also attached my blog – very neglected due to toooo much going on in my life MashAllah. Home schooling my kids these days as well, due to my frustrations with the education system here that focuses on creating zombies rather than learners.
Unfortunately it is not likely that I will make it to Lahore for your meeting, but I am very keen to hear the outcomes. Also do feel free to contact me directly if you think of any great strategies we can co-conspire on!
Asalaam aleikum,
Danielle
Glad to hear that!
I have a thing or two to say about eduction too. And if you haven’t done so already, you can start here to see other resources that I can only hope you find useful.
And yes, co-conspirators are always welcome! 🙂
Dear Danielle , good to hear from you sister Madiha. Call me on 03444181818 and plan to visit my dairy farm at Rawat.
My younger bro Tayyab sends his regards and tells me to help u guys out in any way……so ur welcome.
I am happy to know that you’ve married a Pakistani, hope you are happy. Pls tell me what do you need in farming, you may share any Q? I will be happy to help.
SALAMS to your family.
Salam sister I am from perth living in Rawalpindi since last three years with four kids.i want to know about your blog regarding dairy farming and I wish if I could speak to you send me your email or number.thanks very much.
Hi Danielle,
Just came across your post on this blog. Not sure how far you guys have reached with your plans, hope you’re doing well. I’m also planning to move back to Pak and start my own dairy venture this year, IA. I am based in Rwp as well. It would be great if we could compare notes. My email is [email protected].
Regards,
Nauman
I am considering to start dairy business. Can anyone give me tips on buying animals (as what to look for and how to confirm what the sellers claim about their animals)and also some useful contacts
is your infrastructure complete ? are you ready to buy animals
Thanks for ur reply shahzad. No it is in initial stages but reason i asked the question was to prepare myself as two locals have approached me to sell their animal and they claim it is cross breed but i felt lost in how to confirm it..however i should be ready to buy Insha Allah in two months but i take ur point i will buy the animal when my place is ready.
Regards
where are u setting up ? Location ?
ASA,
Alhamdulillah,
Finally i sign for a piece of land and started basic required work of construction, as i am interior designer and have construction experience of years i am trying to manage better structure and environment in low cost.
I plan for breed management farm for the first 2 years and develop cross breed herd at better feed, environment and special take care… After so many calculations plus, minus, multiplications and meeting so many peoples in the field and Out from field, motivation and demoralized. I decide finally to go with breed management but not for milking till next year.
So please pray for me…
InshAllah, all the best will come to you Babar! 🙂 Keep all of us posted here about developments 🙂
Inshallah brother we’ll pray for u and Allah Helps Those who helps themselves
looking forward to heare soon from u
good luck
Aslamoaliakam to all of you I am living in uk at the moment but I am planing to settle in pakistan and start a dairy farm on small scale. I dont have much cash and also i have got land about 20 kanal with 3 rooms in my village. Fresh water is problem in this land because land 15 to 20 deep surface is hard (sand type stone). But around the land land a seasonal stream runs, can I stop that water with small dame wall and use that for farm. My land is in gujarkhan area. I am still confuse about silage and feed. Please can u guide me, do I need lots of water to grow crop for silage
ecause in my area normaly people rely on rain water. Please cansome give me
Please can someone tell me how much money do I need to start a farm with 100,lt milk production. Can i buy silage from market if yes then sort of price. I am planing to visit pakistan very soon, can meet some experts running farms in suroundings of gujarkhan and rawalpindi
Assalam Wa Alaikum
Jabbar.
I am currently residing in the UK, like yourself. I also have an interest in dairy farming in pakistan. Maybe we can exchange emails and discuss the pro’s and con’s of such an enterprise.
Abdul wahid
hi me umair ch sir can u post me your number or email plz
i also want to start this busniess and want to discuss som we need your contact of mr jabbar mahmood so plz contact us by mail or give your contact number
dear, i want to start this dairy farm business with atleast 10 cows, i would like someone to help me with it. i would appreciate, this is my first time putting my hand in this business, i hope Allah helps me. my email is given [email protected]
i am from karachi.
AOA , have you started up the business? want to know about your experience.. as i am at the stage where you were in 2012,
I think I manage to find all answeres about dairy farming here except where to supply the milk in bulk in district rawalpindi area and if any body knows what is current rate is the moment. I am keen to visit a running farm in gujarkhan surounding area if anybody can help me please
Thanks
Jabbar
hi Danielle Ali Shah,
I read ur post and was surprised to find out that you are setting up a dairy farm close to Fatehjang, I am also in the process of setting up a commercial dairy farm in the surroundings of Fatehjang but I would like to advise you that pay special attention to the location that you choose as we have major water issues in our area as we are reliant on rainfall there is no irrigation system such as canals etc and there is certain areas where the underground water is very scarce where as in certain areas it is plentiful.
Also for buying animals you will have to head towards southern punjab as our local breed known as “Dhani” is a very muscular breed typically known for racing bulls and has hardly any milk!!
although temperature wise our area is much more suitable compared to the southern part as the temperature at this end is relatively better and imported animals produce better results!!
Good luck with your project!!
Wa aliekum salaam Sardar, and i am comforted to know we are not the only crazy people in the area! Are you from Fateh Jhang? We bought land last year next to Shahpur Dam, and have just organised the water to be pumped from the Dam. InshAllah now water will be less of a problem… our wheat crop was very sad due to lack of water. We sunk two bores but they yield only about half an hour of water total and very salty.
What kind of cows are you using in your dairy? LOL I have seen those racing bulls – I have NEVER heard anything like it in my life, but this is Pakistan – anything can happen!! We dont have any cows at all yet – planning inshAllah later this year to start that part. In the mean time have been working with chickens.
Good to be in touch and look forward to hearing more about your venture.
Danielle
yes I am from the area my farmlands are about 12 kms past shahpur dam on khaur road currently I am installing sprinkler systems, increasing my water sources small dams,wells and bores etc trying to establish a self sustained organic dairy farm!! as for the cows once the sheds are made I will be importing crossbreds from Australia. my email is [email protected] do stay in touch.
Hi Shahzad,
Can I have your number or email id as I will need your help in buying the cows for my dairy farm
Salaam umair,
My email is [email protected]. Umair where do you live at the moment.
Regards
Jabbar
Dear All,
Assalam Alaikum. I am a pakistan born and brought up in Dubai, from the investment sector. ( working for a multinational in Investments and Business Development). i have recently looked into the Dairy farm business near Rawalpindi , Kahuta to be precise and would appreiate if someone could give me thier details as i would like to know a bit more before i head to pakistan and start with the infrastructure work.
Your help will be much appreciated.
I am kamran and i am also working to establish dairy farms near faisalabad and islamabad.
What details do you want.
Dear Kamran,
I am wanted to know about payment terms and milk pricing formula.
Regards,
Wasif Ali
Dear Muhammad Sajiid,
I’m also pakistani living & running my business in kuwait.i would like to start my dairy business in pakistan.i’m near to abbottabad & i would like to start in our land.we have a nice place for this business.
I love dairy farming
Me intend to build a new dairy farm in which the prime focus is to build a shed for cows. We have the required land under our own ownership & also have 3 Lakhs to build the same; however, we need the money to purchase cows. We have decided that whoever will purchase for us 20 Australian cows, we’ll repay him the lump sum within two years on monthly installments of 50,000 & will also make him our 50% partner in our farm business.We’ll look after the farm ourselves. Whoever will get us 20 cows bought, we’ll give him a cheque as a testimony ,equal to the cost spent on cows’ purchase. We’ll also write an agreement affidevit stating the 50% partnership of the one giving us loan since we dont want to get interest based loans from banks. We belive in pure business, free of any interest on loans that may spoil our good deeds. If any further agreement or proof is required in this regard,we are ready to serve for the same. We live in district Gujranwala village ‘Nounikey’ where our property is located & we desire to build our farm there. Pls advise us further in this regard. Looking forward for your swift response. Regards
Mubsher Hassan
dear Hassan Bhai,
Have you started your dairy bussines or you are still thinking ..?
Please let me know if you are still looking for an investor or whatever else.
Best regards
Rafaqat
Have you started your business by now
Dear Experts & Mohammad
Could u plz recommend the right place to get good cross breed cows? And the estimated cost?
Mohammad!
If am right, the gentleman sitting on the stage that meet up day is a breeder, is he? Does he provide animals to humble beginners or just to Bigwigs?
Do u recommend selling milk to Nestle’ in the settling phase of the farm? It would save time & efforts to develop one’s own clientele, i mean till the time we get settle with the animals. Once we get over this phase we can focus to develop our own customer pipeline??
Your feedback will make things easy.
Regards
Yes Amna, the gentleman sitting on the stage does provide for ‘humble’ beginners too 🙂
I do recommend selling to nestle (or any other milk procurement/marketing company), especially initially.
For two reasons: when you’re starting a farm, it involves a lot of systems. “SELLING” your milk is a system too. Giving it to nestle just makes it easier for you to focus on milk production.
Second, to “SELL” milk you need to think of it is as a different business altogether! Dairy Farm is primarily milk production, selling milk is a marketing field. So if you start selling your own milk, you increase your dairy’s complexity.
AOA does anyone have experience insuring his animals? How to insure and which company? Any info?
Slam to All my friends,
i’m 1 of those who appreciated this approach of momekh bro on very early days of this blog about 1 year ago, i’m interested, 🙂 since i was very young as my granfather used to lov animals hence me too 🙂 …. im very found of this business not only for money but also passion about havin animals…coming to main point due to some reasons i cud not return bak to pakistan as im here in spain.but my brother will help me to establish dairy farm in pakistan(he is also spanish resident ).we have done some farcasting about it Alhamdulillah land is not a problem but we ve some variable data which can change the results of farcasting in uncertainty i want to kno whether it is fair or not
plz if any1 of you have recent experiences than share with us
regarding
1.what estimated cost would be per cow that can produce 15 litres per time(2 times 30 lts)we can INSHALLAH provide excellent enviroment.
2. at what price we can sell milk per litr to nestle or any company ???and what is the process of selling them milk,like whether they would come to dairy or we should go to them
Thanks 🙂
Dear Mohammad
Thank u very much for ur response!
Could u share the contact info of “the gentleman sitting on the stage” ?? I understand that u recommend him?
And can we visit ur farm? Since it is not a huge one it would be the best example for us. If possible kindly share the address.
Regards
As Salamu Alaikum wa Rehmatulahi wa Barakatuhu
I live in Karachi, can this Dairy Farming business be started in Karachi, or is it meant for village/open fields area only?
In the city itself will probably be not allowed. But on the peripheries, yes.
Most milk in big cities comes from semi-urban dairy farms.
Wa salam it can be started in karachi i do have dairy business if you want to find more call me Mustafa
03323896133 or email me [email protected]
I’m from Karachi and willing to start dairy business , have u start this?
guys do not start farming unless
you people are strong
, consistant
Do not buy australian cows anymore they are no good.
have all the time to spent on herd management.
im waiting for the ban to lift from importing australian cows.
25 cows X 425000
construction for 50 cows X 100000
almost 525000 per cow
Annual average 25 ltr per cow
All costs equal to 15 ltr per cow
profit 10 ltr per cow.
some cows will give 30 Plus ltr even it can touch 40 plus in winter but after overall your herd annual average per cow per day will be 25 Ltr.
First year it will be good
second year it will go down.
they will adapt soon
3rd year it will gain good results
1.Shade
2.water
3.vacination
4.fooder………………all year the the fodder mix should be same……if u change milk production will suffer.
5.taking care of udders.
there are so many things.
Practical training is being given by punjab government.
Very important.
guys do not start farming unless
you people are strong
, consistant
Do not buy australian cows anymore they are no good.
have all the time to spent on herd management.
im waiting for the ban to lift from importing australian cows.
25 cows X 425000
construction for 50 cows X 100000
almost 525000 per cow
Annual average 25 ltr per cow
All costs equal to 15 ltr per cow
profit 10 ltr per cow.
some cows will give 30 Plus ltr even it can touch 40 plus in winter but after overall your herd annual average per cow per day will be 25 Ltr.
First year it will be good
second year it will go down.
they will adapt soon
3rd year it will gain good results
1.Shade
2.water
3.vacination
4.fooder………………all year the the fodder mix should be same……if u change milk production will suffer.
5.taking care of udders.
there are so many things.
Practical training is being given by punjab government.
Very important.
If you guys have more questions
Dear Rana sb,
Which Cow breed do you suggest to be most economical?
Regads,
any department funding for dairy forming
Rana bhai
Which Department of Punjab Government is giving practical training, where the training center is located.
Ghazanfar Ali
i am running a small dairy farm in karachi bhains colony landhi i have catteles i want to know abbout theair fed for more milk ,any one help me
This is the best resource on starting a business. Thanks Momekh.
Hello All – Can anyone tell me how to lease land to start dairy business?
Asalam o alekum
I m reviewing your blog since last weak, and found that it is very informative and give lot of ideas about dairy firming. Great work.
I m having some questions related dairy farming.
Q1- Why Not Buffalo (is there any harm in Buffalo farming, although the quality of milk is better than Cow?)
Q2- In Some areas in pakistan like (Rahim yar khan, Sadiqabad and surrounding people interested in more buffalo milk then cow milk. What you suggest)?
Q3- This Question Confused me a lot. Lactation period of Buffalo and milk yielding per day? ( People having buffalo claims that they are get 18 to 22+ milk liter per day, But the reports on the internet ..i search a lot about this that buffalo produce 8 to 12 liter milk per day ) so kindly explain this senario.
Q4- Can buffalo cross breed by Cow? (like Buffalo is Nil Ravi and Male Cow is Sahiwal full breed or Fresian… just as an examples).
Q4- Need Suggestion over open a dairy firm of cow is better or Buffalo? in the areas of Rahimyar khan surroundings?
Q5- Any ideas of cost of good quality of buffalo whose per day yielding is 12 to 15 litre ?
I would love to see your respond or anyone who knows about that is highly appreciated.
Waiting for your response.
Thanks & Kind Regards.
.. teaslamoo alaikum. is there any govt farm from where i can get young animals for beef farming or dairy farming.????
i want to purchase some sahiwal heifer is there any farm providing heifers on reasonable prices
Assalamu Alaikum Warehmatulah!
Brother Momekh,
How are you? How your dairy farm is progressing? What is added in your learning in the recent monts?
I am a bit interested in the business.
Hi Momekh,
Hope you are doing well, and have lovely holidays. I wanted to ask you about selling price of fresh milk these days…and what is the payment mechanism
Selling price of milk depends whom you’re selling to. Sell to Nestle etc is the worst price (I currently sell to Nestle btw). Selling directly to the consumer is the best price.
As luck would have it, by God’s Grace, I sell to both.
My dairy farm’s milk is currently being sold to Nestle. I am also selling milk in Lahore after buying from a trustworthy, hard-to-find contractor. Price difference is significant.
One thing to note: starting a dairy farm and selling milk directly to consumer ARE TWO SEPARATE BUSINESSES.
If you are starting a dairy farm, I suggest you pick the low-hanging fruit (of selling to Nestle or other large buyer of milk). If you want to set up a marketing and distribution setup, I suggest you prepare yourself to start another business. Do not consider “selling milk to homes” as an extension of the dairy farm, think of it as a COMPLETELY SEPARATE business. It will help God willing. 🙂
Thank you Momekh, I want to sell to Companies like Nestle and etc. I wanted to know normal how much do Nestle pays and how is payment terms and proceedure…regards wasif ali
The rates vary!
Depends on the region. Also, depends on your volume of milk. You have to check from your local area.
Nowadays, I hear Nestle is playing tough (they don’t need as much milk). But I am never in favor of starting a dairy farm depending solely on Nestle.
Hope this helps.
Dear Mr.Momekh,
I must say that it is a very useful forum for Freshers. Can you please let me know about the criteria of nestle for buying milk from a farmer. I mean the minimum Quantity of Milk supply, Quality evaluation, location of Farmer etc.
I will be grateful for your assistance.
Best Regards,
Umer from Chakwal
I want to start Dairy Farming business. Can any one tell me how much money do I need for this. If I start with ten Cows.I live in Swabi, Khyber Pakhtoon Khwa. My E mail is [email protected]
u have required approximately 15 lakh
Aisha please do contact me at [email protected]. So excited that there is a Perth girl here!!!
Danielle
I need some contacts (references) of contractors for cow shed construction in Lahore. Could any one please help.
If some can suggest where I can buy needed materials, that will also help. Thanks.
Salam to all brothers and sisters,
I am glad to be here and read about dairy farming as i am a fan of this
field.
I am a pakistani leving in Greece for the last 15 yars.
As all Pakistanies leaving abroad my dream is to return back and smell
“apne watan ki mitti ko” and could establish a profitable bussines which
could be no other than Dairy Farming.
Can any one suggest me where i could find good mix breed animals
and how much will it cost me about 20 cows ?
I own Land , tube well, can make a good shed, if any one is interested
to come to my place to cooparate is most well come or I could invest in someones already running bussines.
my e-mail is : [email protected]
I leave in Greece – Athenes
My back ground : Pakistan,Gujrat,Kharian
Dear All
Salam
What is the prospect of establishing dairy farm in Chakwal region. The major issue there is that of water. Besides this the current electricity situation may require some alternate setup; most probably mid scale solar energy system. Although there are small dams but lifting water to a upper level is a costly affair.
Any body from this region having fair idea of this business keeping in view the climatic and logistic conditions. Best thing is the motor way which is approachable from my native town Balkassar where we have got huge bunch of land (cultivated as well as banjar)
Anybody’s guidance will help in thinking of starting this proposition.
Regards
Asad
{phone number edited — please don’t paste phone numbers here)
There are quite a few from Chakwal here… don’t know if they are reading this message though.
Alt energy is a must by the way.
Solar systems for dairy farms is a topic in itself, that is why I am working on a new information portal (you can see it here — I am adding content to it nowadays). But I hope that it helps. You can ask questions there on relevant articles related to solar.
Other than that, I welcome you to LifeETC by Momekh… do join the community for updates regarding creative self employment and living a life of adventure (if that’s your thing 🙂 )
Hmmmmmm so far so good this blog is doing very good coz owner himself spending time for his blog that’s the big sign of healthy turn over .i would like to appreciate Momkeh for his efforts for new comers coming into dairy business and vice versa good feed back coming everyday.May Allah make it easy for us to help each other without any complexity jazakallah!!
Thank you for the kind words Saif. JazaakAllah 🙂
Anyone selling holstein freisian calfs or hiefers in Layyah district.
I wish to buy 10 animals.
For pure freisian calf, I can pay 30k- targeted age is 6 mths and sex is female.
For hiefer, I am looking at 140k.
Any farm owner interested in selling, please forward your details. I ‘ll get back to you.
Pure Holistein MALE calves are available, heifers will be ready in few months
My pleasure admin,plz keep us updated with all new info regarding dairy like diseases,vaccinations,breeding etc.costing low season high season etc thanks jazakallah
My name is Omer, And I am intending to start a dairy farm in the outskirts of Karachi in Janruary- February 2014, Inshallah.
I have worked out a feasibility for the farm of 20 buffallows. assuming that the animal will give at least a minimum of 10 liters per day and having a lactation period of 270 days.
I have assumed that I will be able to purchase the animals for 230,000 each. Is this correct???
Further after a lot of research I am intending to setup a corn silage in which I can store atleast a full year fodder for the 20 animals.
Can anybody please help me in the silage issue???? As I dont know what quantity will I be needing for my herd.
Further can u please also tell me if its better to use buffallow of cows for dairy purpose???
I dont have any dairy farming experience , but I have some experience in buying and selling cows at the time of EID, where I purchased 82 heavy animals and sold them in the VIP block of Sorabhgoth Mawaishi Mandi KArachi.
Any help will be much appreciated.
Regards
Omer
hi sir hru. hope u r gd n energetic as usual
hello friend,
i am from peshawar and i want loan for dairy farm i have my own milk shop and animals and i want to spread my bussiness please help me to rise if u want ,, any idea ?
regards , RaheelSubhan
I wish to establish a business of livestock and dairy farming in Rawalpindi/Islamabad. In this regard, I am interested to get formal training in this field prior to start my own business.
Therefore, I will appreciate if you can provide me contacts and address of such Institute in Rawalpindi / Islamabad (or neighbouring cities) to qualify myself in this trade.
Regards
Imran Masood
Islamabad
kindlt let me know the best combination of buffalo and copws for small scale dairy farm
3 buffaloes to 1 cow.
Dear
2 cows 1 buffalo
I want to know the price of deers in Pakistan?
About 3 to 5 lacks
I have 25 acer land in sanglahill. I want start dairy farm in my land. With help of nestle milk pak, let me know pls how can i start dairy farm
Would someone explain that why cows are preferred over buffaloes in dairy farming whereas the milk consumers in general prefer buffalo milk?
Cows produce more milk then Buffaloes that is why they are preferred from business point of view and for same reason those dairy farmers who sell milk to operators prefer cows mostly.
Can any one please guide me on the following points!
1.Cost of planting 1 acre of maize/corn crop?
2.Sale price of standing maize crop?
3. How many Kg or Mann of maize is obtained from 1 acre of crop in irrigated land? and also in barani land
4. Can 2 maize crops be harvested in a year form barani land?
Please help me out on the above points. I have to prepare a feasibility and business plan.
i have land and Dairy farm in mansehra i have 4 cow i need more cow… i have a big farm… and land so plz help me for this kindly ….. installment pe b cow mil jae to ma le sakta hun
im m.akmal mahar
i have 40 acer land and i want to do business of dairy form with nestle please guide me
I am jahangir sundhu.I have 70 acre land.I have 60 animals cows and Buffalo. Village baghairmar near kot radha kishan.I want to advance dairy farm and need more cows.help me feeding …silage?
sir i am dr ramzan from sahiwal i have 3 years experience in commecial dairy farming
any information for dairy farming
contact no 0304-1944260
A,a
Dear friends,
Recently I have completed my graduation and now I want to start a cattle farm….with a proper and professional shed..I want to start it on a medium level then I will elaborate it..I have my own land..kindly guide me how much land should I use and from how many animals should I start?
Thanku
why are you charging in dollars for book..
i dont have credit card so how can i buy your book?????
Because of the payment processing online, and also because of the fluctuating dollar to rupee rate…
And yes, you can pay in pak rupees via bank transfer or easy paisa.
i like it .
Salaam wa Rehmat Allah, thank you all for sharing information… is this forum still functional? i need some updated information.
🙂
Dear brothers and sisters,
A few years ago I got inspired by the “success” stories of Mr. Momekh and other farming enthusiasts and decided to jump into the field of dairy farming myself. I have been in this business for over 2 years now and have invested millions and millions of rupees into it.
We started out developing a 200 kanal piece of raw land in district Attock, Punjab, and eventually after a year or so had reached the point where we were procuring Holstein-Friesian and Jersey cows (pregnant heifers to be precise) and lining up large/bulk buyers of cow’s milk. Every process was carried out professionally, our farm was setup correctly, we got very good animals and we were quite excited about this new venture.
Unfortunately, after 2 years of being in this game, I can very confidently say that producing and selling milk is not really a profitable line of business. Too too many factors affect and disturb the performance and milk yield of livestock, especially the sudden outbreaks of disease and the extremes of weather. There are numerous problems lurking in the background all the time, which surface at the worst moment possible, leaving you helpless and defeated. Mortality of calves is very common and is a great setback. It is mentally and physically exhausting work that has very little or no reward at all. Feeding costs are tremendous and constitute atleast 60-70% of your total expenditure. Feeding costs are steadily rising with time, much faster than the price of milk is rising. Prices of feeding inputs such as fodder, silage, straw, hay, vanda, concentrates etc are inflating by 10-15% per year, whereas the farm gate price of milk is increasing by only 5% per year.
Believe me, we have still not made any profit from this business even after two years of hard work! Its not even a matter of small or large scale. I have personally seen the Profit & Loss statements of several modern mega dairy farms in Punjab that have 2,000-5,000 cows, yet are not making any substantial income or profit for their owners, and some of them are even in a net loss.
My advice to anyone deciding to get into this field is to please STOP immediately! Dont even think about it! Invest your hard-earned money in any other business, but not this one. I guarantee that you will highly regret investing your capital, resources, time and energy into dairy farming business in Pakistan.
Best wishes,
Faisal
ASA. Dear brother i am from Attock and i was just about to jump into dairy farming and your this advice stopping me.
Br i am from Attock district`s Tehseel Jand Pindighyp.
So could you please like me to visit your farm and to sea if i have to jump into it or not and please tell me what exactly you have been doing into dairy farming brother.
-Milk selling ? and what rate of milk was given to you?
-Bought animals small and skinny and after fattening and growing them up you soled?
what else?
Dear, may i have your contact number, actully i am just about to enter in this business.. setting up the farm in Fateh Jung..BUT now would like to meet you first…????
I need some contacts (references) of contractors for cow shed construction in Lahore. Could any one please help.
If some can suggest where I can buy needed materials, that will also help. Thanks.